Transcript: How to Drive City Excellence Through Startup Success

And we're back. Oh, man. So we're gonna, I'm gonna make sure to ask here, Marcus, if you can just make sure to post the new link in our LinkedIn event, just so everybody has access to it and we'll get back into the actual conversation. Oh my goodness. Every, every day, there's there's always something technical that we're working through but you know what we, I gotta thank you know, like, all the people that contribute to technology in this.

You know it's it and that's exactly what we're going to be talking about right. To technology, you know, we would not be able to fare through the pandemic without all of these tools. Imagine, you know, they didn't have these things when you know when the last pandemic actually took place so it's just I feel grateful to have the ability to have such a connected world. I'll tell you since our last conversation in 2018 I became a dad and I know there are many a family members, grandparents, etc.

that had it not been for FaceTime or the equivalent would have been devastated to miss an entire year of my son's growth, you know, like that connection is so important to us. Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. Well, congratulations. Thank you. That's a big one.

All right, so adaptation to technology right like we were talking about that here with the pandemic but like from a from a city perspective as well. What has your, what has your thoughts been about, you know how that's taking place. Not just obviously with with our online tools but we're going to be talking about startups right startups and how they integrate with the entire ecosystem. You know it's interesting I think there's, as I said earlier, so much opportunity for cities to innovate and to update. But there is a reality, and I don't want to oversimplify this but to illustrate the challenge.

There is a reality to what happens within a city and understanding that city leaders are taking on a risk, not just a risk for the city but a personal risk I mean it's they're, they're the ones held responsible if an innovative, an innovative solution malfunctions. And so, one of the real challenges that leading cities has seen over now 13 years, working with cities to become smarter more resilient is that there is this kind of human element that can create create a real roadblock. And so the best way to get over that hurdle is to do two things.

Number one, reducing the risk associated with innovating for a city and simultaneously increasing the confidence that that city leader has in implementing a new innovative solution rather than doing things the same old way they've always been done. And so, I do think that pandemic certainly helped a little bit with that because you know as we always say that necessity is the mother of invention. And the pandemic highlighted a whole new set of necessities that cities had. So from the mundane things like simple things that have always been done the same way like permitting, getting a building permit.

Super, well, I'm sure if you ask anybody who's looking for a permit they want to describe it as super simple. But the process is fairly simple you know you go to City Hall you file the application blah blah blah. But what happens when City Hall is shut down. It stopped the permitting process right then and it strikes. And so that's not just about the individual who's trying to you know build an addition on to their home or or build a new you know affordable housing complex or whatever it might be.

It's debilitating to an entire industry. And now you're talking about people's livelihoods, their income. So these these challenges snowball and create bigger issues you know a community that's now suffering financially, not just with the looming threat of the coronavirus. So just that one example you can see how cities now might have a greater appreciation for an online based permitting process. Because in the future whatever it might be you know another pandemic or massive snowstorm or whatnot it's not going to shut down city government in the same way.

I do think by the way we're in an interesting period of this transformation process. And so I do think that cities have to recognize that you can't just flip a switch and suddenly be all digital for instance. You know there is a digital divide that's very real exists in every community. And whether that's financially driven or whether that's age driven I mean there's any number of reasons. But we don't want to be leaving anybody behind.

So I do think this period that we're in right now is I refer to it as kind of the mirror period. Where we're mirroring two worlds you know the analog world and the digital world and this transformation from one to the other. And I think that's okay. I mean it does maybe require some upfront investments and maybe we're running dual systems you know for a little while. But eventually the transition will be over and then cities and their residents their businesses everybody benefits.

Yeah you brought up such good points. The idea of de-risking first of all. Man I think to your point it's about to your point it's about reducing the barriers to doing the things that are most important to continue to engage in livelihood. Right. Like whatever that means to every single individual right.

All the citizens. But to your point also about getting to a place of you know mirroring just so that there is coverage if you will. Exactly. All of all of the necessities both in digital and in a physical space or just kind of figuring out what that path is to that to having it primarily digital. It's so important to your point about providing that access so that we're not creating a broader digital divide than already exists because it does exist.

It absolutely exists. Yes. And we saw that we saw that very prominently in education. I mean the number of stories I think we've all heard and those were not even a fraction of the total number of stories that existed. But you know the family all sharing one cell phone you know for kids trying to use it during the day you know and then having to switch off.

I mean all those who had no access to such devices or Internet access at all. I mean it's and that's I'm just talking here in the US. I mean when you think about more developing nations it's even if it's even harder. Actually I know we'll talk about a cell city but on this topic it's worth mentioning that we have one of our semi finalists in this year's a cell city cohort who the company is called Jara. They've actually developed a handheld education device essentially the replacement for a smartphone let's say that can be solar powered or crank powered and can be updated through telephone lines rather than Internet.

So it becomes an equally valuable education tool in low power low Internet communities. That is really really cool. Yeah. I mean it's amazing the solutions that are out there. This is what I love about our about the work we do with startups and the cell city program in particular.

Yeah yeah we're definitely going to get into that for sure. I know I didn't want to rush it but it was it was an important point to make right there. You're absolutely right. So you know to your point like there there there's the focus on what's important today versus what do we need to address longer term that we know we can't we can we just have to put a bandaid on it today. So curious as to what are your what are your thoughts as to the typical that kind of gets that on the back burner.

From what you've seen. You know it's a great question. I think every community is a bit different to be honest and I feel like that's such a politician type answer. But it is actually true. I mean as I said before necessity is the mother of all invention but necessity is actually what drives priorities.

And you know we've all heard that adage the squeaky wheel gets the oil and I think that's very true in in in this situation as well where cities that have a particular issue are more likely to address that issue. But with the pandemic I will say I think it definitely highlighted a number of issues that have existed for a long time. And I wouldn't even say they were on the back burner. I just don't even think they were recognized. You know they weren't on a burner at all.

And that's not to say that people were oblivious. I don't want to suggest that it was just that the system in place seemed to be working. You know coming back to the example of the permitting I mean permits were were applied for permits were issued construction happened didn't seem like anything was wrong. But when you so that's an example where I don't even think digitize digitalizing the permitting process in a lot of particularly smaller communities was a was a I wasn't even on a burner. But when suddenly cities hall was city halls were shut down that whole process that antiquated process frankly was you know you can't even get a permit to do that.

So it did it put it not only on a burner it put it on a front burner. Yeah. Yeah. Well I've had my day at City Hall enough times dealing with permits and all different types of. So trust me I'm very familiar with your talking about and there was a digitized process at City Hall and I still had to be there.

So to your point about antiquated. Yes I think I mean but there's so many there's so many other things. I mean it could be as simple as I mean we moved to Madison from Chicago right before the pandemic and something as simple as navigating through like getting a new license plate in a new area like oh my goodness. Yeah. You know it's it's they're they're very simple but mundane things that are very important.

You know but I wonder when it comes to like the big things to how is how is now this covert response kind of like wrapped up wrapped up into how we're thinking about access and resiliency. Right. Like are they are you seeing them as like just the covert response if you will just wrapped into the like a new updated approach to some of these things. I am I think you know the term resiliency is probably a great way to start this conversation because I think our understanding of that word as it applies to cities has actually broadened and needed to be broader as a result of covert 19.

For instance not that long ago pre pandemic you you would talk about resiliency and for most people the connotation there was you know the threat of sea level rise and because 95 percent of the world's cities are coastal cities it's very much a city issue. And so that was kind of the the resiliency response pre pandemic but during and now post pandemic well hopefully soon post pandemic. Well I'm already seeing that the term resiliency is no longer just about sea level rise or even climate. It's it's about economic resiliency it's about health resiliency it's about community resiliency and these are really important conversations that we should be having.

So in many ways to answer your question I see covert 19 or this pandemic as definitely intertwined kind of wrapped up in it. I do think there are some initiatives that are going to be very specific to pandemic type responses. You know because let's face it in the future of human humanity this will not be the last pandemic that we have to deal with. So I think we'll you know assess what happened this time around will improve upon our responses and we'll we'll be better prepared for the next one.

So there are very specific covert 19 or pandemic related issues but I think you know because covert 19 had such a widespread effect on people and communities that it has actually infiltrated almost every aspect of city life from our housing to our transportation to the permitting to our education system to our security. I mean one thing after another has has kind of experienced some impact from this pandemic and as a result I think it's giving us an opportunity to improve on all of those systems. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

That makes complete sense. Man, part of me is saying like I'm really sorry it took this. Yeah. You know, but at the same time there is that that silver lining and and we got to take advantage of this new lens that we have. You know I think positivity is both a blessing and a curse.

I like to think of myself as a positive individual I think humans in general tend to be positive overall and it's easy to as a result to see the positive in the situation today, rather than focusing on the negative of what could happen, you know and then preparing for that. I think it's really a trained skill to be able to think like that and it's an important skill so that you're not caught off guard you're not caught unprepared. And and again this pandemic I think has just made us realize you know take a step back reflect a little bit and say look, we need to be thinking a little bit more about the potential threats that exists and and get ready for them.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's, it's good. It's good to think about things in terms of risks and opportunities, right and and seeing you know seeing what what you can glean from the situation in order to make good, solid, cohesive plans. That makes sense in the timing right that that makes sense. So, yeah, really, really good.

Thanks for that feedback here. I do want to kind of reset the conversation here just for those who might be listening in. So today we're talking with Michael Lake from leading cities and we're talking about how to drive city excellence through startup success, we have not touched on the startups too too much yet, but we're going to so I just wanted to invite those who are listening to say hello, chime in, tell us you're listening. So I'm going to give you an opportunity to ask some questions.

I will raise them if you type them in the chat. And, and ask Michael, and if you're on clubhouse with us. We do have a few people here in the audience. We welcome you to raise your hand if you're interested in asking a question, and we will have you up on stage to speak with Michael as well. So with that, I will jump into our conversation about a cell city so you can actually tell us a bit more about that.

What, what is it, and how did how did it come about. Yeah, it's a great question. So actually, cell city has become one of the largest smart city smart and resilient city focused accelerators in the world. That was not necessarily our goal, I'll be honest. And to answer your question how it came about.

It really came about, unlike I think most any other accelerate at least that I'm aware of typically which kind of come about from an investment point of view or you know to create a pipeline for potential investment. Ours came about because we recognize this huge divide this chasm that exists between cities and startups. And there are some bureaucratic reasons for that you know where it's it's difficult for cities under some cities, where it's literally illegal to be the first buyer of a new product. And again, these policies, you know they stem from a good place or with good intentions you know, for instance on that one it's it's to prevent a new city official having their brother in law start a company so that they can sell to the city and you know, It does help with kind of corruption, but at the same time, it's become a huge drag on cities ability to innovate.

So what we decided to do is to to tackle this to help bridge that divide between cities and startups and coming back to the point I made earlier about those city officials who, you know, number one, they have to worry about the risks and number two, the risks and not only the risk for the city but for their own employment. You know, they don't want to be fired because a innovative product that they brought into the city went wrong. But also to boost their confidence in these innovative solutions when they might not have years or, you know, a long list of clients who can who they can point to as saying, okay, it worked in all of these places for all of this time.

So our goal was to just create essentially a it's part accelerator, you know, where you were providing a curriculum on focused on the nuances of doing business with cities, understanding things like the language of cities, navigating public procurement, securing no bid contracts, government contracts, things like that. Very nuanced, not your typical startup, very business to government focused. But it's also about a competition. So the the original idea was to to have a process by which startups could compete for and ultimately win paid pilot projects in cities.

And and that would do two things from the city side. You have leading cities who is globally sourcing solutions. So instead of your typical typical RFP process where a city, you know, publishes it, you might get a half a dozen of the usual suspects that apply. Leading cities is going out there and we're globally sourcing solutions. So this year alone, we had five hundred and thirty four applicants from forty four different countries.

But we don't stop there. We then bring in our global network of experts to evaluate all of these applicants and eventually start up the startups that are eventually semi finalists and then ultimately finalists before we get to the winners. And that evaluation process is really important as well, because it's one thing for a city official to evaluate, ask the tough questions, you know, examine, do their due diligence. But it's that much more reassuring for them when a whole group of experts have done the same thing and came up with the same conclusion that this is a solid solution.

So between the sourcing side and the vetting side, we're able to de risk and simultaneously increase that confidence that city officials can have. Now, we we did experience a little bit of a setback as a program with covid-19, the pandemic, because obviously and rightfully so cities were focused on responding to the COVID-19 pandemic. So last year we did something different. We did not have your typical city sponsored tracks, whereas the year before that, for instance, we had two cities, one who sponsored a track in smart parking and the other in water.

And they get to choose their winner. They get all the feedback from all the experts. But they ultimately have to be the one doing business with them. So they get to the final say the city gets the final say. I'm proud to say that one of those cities was based right here in Massachusetts, New Bedford, and they just completed the first installation of it's called Express Park brought to them by Ha Parking, who was their track winner.

And it's a touchless parking system. And they've applied it initially to the beaches, which was not even part of the original scope of the pilot. So they've already expanded the original project, which is great. And so we're seeing success in the city. And we're seeing a lot of people that are going to be able to get a lot of feedback from the city.

We just announced our newest winner last year's winner. The company called Beal. And actually, I can get into that later if you want. But the point is, we're continuing to connect these companies directly with pilot projects, which is something that is great. But the point is that we're not only seeing success, but we also see success in the final project.

Which is a huge part of our program. And unlike, I think, any other accelerator in the world. I mean, it's just so fascinating how it all has come about and the successes. What I really like about the program is that you have a bit of checks and balances in it. And there's an opportunity for that validation by other cities to say, yeah, this is a viable solution.

Yes, I think that it would make sense and it would work. And what it does is it gives more exposure to the company as well. So maybe not today, right? Like going through a South City this term, right? But maybe three years from now, one of these cities that's reviewing, they may say, you know what?

I know a company. That's it. Exactly. And I'll tell you one other important point that I believe in deeply. And so sometimes it's a little bit of a difficult conversation with our city partners.

But I believe pilots should be paid. I don't really buy into the concept of an unpaid pilot, you know, because let's face it, startups are already struggling, you know, to keep the doors open. And the very long sales cycles dealing with government don't make it any easier. So to add on top of that, the fact that they would actually have to deploy a solution without getting paid for it to me is just not quite a fair system. So we do demand that or require that our city partners pay for the pilots.

And part of the reason there is because as the person in the middle or the organization in the middle, we're looking out for the best interests of both the cities and the startups. And so from the startups point of view, you know, they don't have to just prove that their solution works. They also have to prove to cities that other cities are willing to pay for it. And so that's an important part of the equation. And so, you know, it actually makes it more difficult for startups to convince the second city to buy their solution when the first city got it for free.

True, very true. Yeah. It's like what handout did you give them? Can we get the same thing? No.

Yeah, it's about setting that value to start with. Correct. Exactly right. And it's a win-win situation. Huh?

Yeah, you know, very strategic. I like it. But we're practical. Yeah. Yeah, it's true that I would completely agree with that.

Yeah. Well, I'm just so fascinated by the approach and, you know, you do this every year. So like, what are the next steps? Right. Like you mentioned the win, the winner.

We do want to hear more about like this past around and then like want to hear like, OK, well, what is what is the plan for next year? So I guess what first things first, tell us about this this one that we just finished up. And we'd love to know who the winner is. Like you just mentioned, like what what their next steps are in this whole process. And then let's let's, I guess, do the future thinking piece.

Sure, sure. So last year's winner of Vicella City was it's a company based out of Barcelona, Spain called BIO. And it's phenomenal. I think what they've done. I mean, we've all heard about renewable energy, solar wind.

But of course, one of the challenges with both is that it's not always producing energy. You don't have any sunlight. You don't have any energy. You don't have any wind. You don't have any energy.

What they have actually done is created a technology that generates electricity directly from soil. Yeah, I love it. I love it. So it's generating electricity 24 hours a day, seven days a week, three hundred and sixty five days a year. And it truly has a totally transformational opportunity for cities, for the world.

But one of the things I started to mention that we've done have always done is have this general track, because it's one thing to have our smart challenges sponsored by cities. As I mentioned a couple of years ago, it was smart parking and water. But we always wanted to keep this program open to everybody or anybody. And so it is difficult. It's impossible, frankly, to ask a city to pay for a pilot for a solution they haven't identified yet for a problem.

They don't know what it is. So given the fact that our program was really trying to connect those startups and cities through a pilot project opportunity, we were a little bit at a loss for a general track prize. So we came up with another idea. It's a sister program that we call a SellaGov. And a SellaGov is essentially the inverse.

If you think of a SellaCity as a global competition for startups to compete for paid pilot projects offered by cities, a SellaGov is a prepaid pilot project offered to cities to compete for. So by winning the SellaCity competition, BO receives $100,000 to go towards a pilot. Now they get $100,000, period. So if it's a $5,000 pilot, then they still walk away with $100,000. So it's not contingent.

But it is meant to support a pilot. We have just announced on June 15th that the city of Hamburg, Germany, was selected as the winner of the SellaGov competition. So they are in process right now of preparing for the deployment of the BO education kit and curriculum in 10 high schools in Hamburg, starting in the new school year. So this is a STEM education program that will inspire a new generation of students in Hamburg to understand not just the technology behind generating energy from soil, but thinking about entrepreneurship, thinking about technology, thinking about science.

And so this is a really interesting project that's just getting underway right now. My engineering brain turned on when you said getting energy from soil. I'm just so fascinated. Look up the website. Actually, where do we find BO?

Like how can we learn more about them? So BO, it's spelled B-I-O-O. I believe the address is BO.com. I can confirm that right now. But it is truly fascinating what they're doing.

And we're proud to have them as a, sorry, it's BOtech.com, B-I-O-O-T-E-C-H.com. And so we're honored to have them as not only an alum of our program, but one of our winners. Yeah, that's so cool. Okay, so we know how they're doing. They got funding to serve for the pilot, and then they're hooked up with Hamburg.

So that's super exciting. Okay, so you also shared a little bit about how cities are getting tied into this based on how you originally programmed this, and then also how you're doing it this year. So that's really great, Pivé. And I suspect as long as you can get your sponsors for this coming year, you'll be able to tie in cities that way to have the pilots work for them. So that's super, super cool.

Okay, so next steps. What are you planning for next term, if you will? So the next, well, we just announced our 50 semi-finalists for this year's cohort. So we're just beginning the next one right now. So I'll answer for both this one and 2022, if you'd like.

But with this particular cohort, we've just added a whole new part of the curriculum on no-bid government contracting, which is a real opportunity for small businesses. I mean, focusing on the U.S. government alone, there's about $600 billion set aside for small businesses. And so understanding the process by which a startup can apply for those, or really, it's barely even an application process, to be honest with you. It's not like an RFP.

It's more like a traditional consumer type engagement than it is an RFP. But understanding that process is really important because it helps our startups to not only secure those contracts, but there's an important thing with the federal government is that if you get past the $300,000 in government contracts, you're basically on, not that they use this term, but like a preferred vendor list. Like you've passed the test. You're beyond probation. You've been validated.

And so now big contracts become available to you. You've developed a relationship. So that's an exciting new addition to this year's programming. We're also launching an investor network, recognizing that these startups, like any startup, needs that investment capital. And we've talked to investors over the years.

And part of it is an education process and a conversation I often have with investors who are quick to say they don't invest in companies that do business with government. And you can appreciate where they're coming from because it's too slow for them. But as I always remind folks that if you're talking about a Silicon Valley type investment, yes, you can count your return on investment with your wristwatch. But if you go to the other end of the spectrum, if you're talking about, for instance, the drug industry, pharmaceuticals, I mean, you can count your return on investment with like not even calendars.

I mean, it's decades. Very true. It is literally decades. So if such patient, as they call it, patient capital exists on the pharmaceutical side and such urgent capital exists on the software side, I always tell people we're like Goldilocks. We're right in the middle with smart cities.

Not too fast, not too slow. But the other thing, and this is actually the more important point, is that I say to our startups all the time that the best investor is a good client. And I say to the investors, you can't ask for a better client than government. You know, they don't go out of business. The federal government prints money, you know.

But in the U.S., if you have a federal contract and they don't pay that contract on time, it's a 50% penalty. So, I mean, there's tremendous advantages to having a government contract. And by the way, they're usually long term contracts, especially for small businesses. It's a five year contract. So when you explain all this to an investor, they very quickly start to see the value.

And so there is this little bit of an education that has to happen. And this is why we're launching Civic, which is our investor network, to bring together investors who are open to investing in the B2G space and realizing the returns that can come about it. So that's another exciting thing. As we look to 2022 with the Sella City, we're already in conversations now that, you know, the city response to this pandemic is no longer the kind of major and only thing they can basically focus on.

We're already having conversations with cities about 2022 who want to host a smart challenge track. And so I think just for those who are listening, I think it's a really interesting insight to say that coming out of this pandemic, cities are indeed more eager to innovate than they were before the pandemic. So I do think that's one of the positive outcomes from all of this. As you said before, tragic that it had to be this that got us there. But we're now there and hopefully there'll be much more innovation within cities around the world.

Man, it's just such an exciting time when it comes to that this match between companies who are really coming up with innovative ideas to figure practical outcomes and governments who are recognizing the opportunity and investors who also recognize the opportunity for investment into products that will help for long term, right? Long term. So on all on all fronts, not just for their investments, but also for impact. Right. So, oh, man, really, really cool.

So I do want to give the opportunity for those who are listening to just type a quick question in the chat. We have been getting some responses to some people saying hello, Andre. Welcome. I know you're both you were in Clubhouse and you're on Twitter now. Stephanie, thank you so much for joining and always supporting Ashley.

Good to see you. And she was she's saying she is stuck on the energy from Beal. Very cool. Once energy becomes free, we're all free. Such a such a great point.

We also have people here in the room. If there is anybody who on Clubhouse, if there's anybody who wants to raise their hand and ask one question, I'll take one question because we are wrapping up close to the hour. Please raise your hand and we'll take a question. But with that, I am so, so, so excited to just have had this catch up with you, Michael. I think what you're doing is a super exciting and I do want to give you the opportunity to share.

Where can people learn more about you and what you're up to? And then also, if they want to get involved, where can they find find, you know, your website? Sure, sure. So our website easy. It's leading cities dot org.

And there are so many ways to get involved. I mean, really what leading cities is and is ultimately doing is building a community. So if you're on the city side, we have solutions for you. If you're on the startup side, we'll help educate you. One of the things I didn't mention that we're going to be launching shortly is a whole incubator space, a physical space.

We already have a virtual space kind of up and running, but in beta version, so to speak, because we weren't able to launch the physical space during the pandemic. But another way we were able to start support startups, we have mentor opportunities. If anybody wants to mentor the and of course, startups, please apply to a cell city all year long. We have a nomination form available on the cell city dot com or you can access it through the leading cities dot org website. But we're always open for nominations for next year's cohort of a cell city startups.

OK, well, that is amazing. Leading cities dot org. You guys can can find more about leading cities. And then if you just do slash a cell city, I believe that's how you get to the settled city information. It seems like there's so many ways to get involved.

I think that, you know, it's just worth it to take a peruse on the website and just learn a little bit more about what's happening there. I think anybody really could benefit from either getting involved or sharing with a friend. So. Just wanted to invite people from from Clubhouse up to the stage one more time. If you have any questions for Michael.

Or comments and response. I know that we have some really interesting folks in the room. And I do want to hear of Michael's time. Go ahead. No, I was just gonna say why we're waiting.

I did just want to make a comment. You mentioned. Yes. And and your sponsor. I think that's something we didn't talk about at all about commercial space in cities and something that cities are going to have to think about the impact post pandemic.

I think we are going to see a real shift in how commercial spaces are used. And I think a company like Yes is right at the forefront. You know, talking about co co-working spaces, I think we're going to see a lot more of that in the future when, you know, traditional tenants in these huge office buildings decide that they don't need every member of their staff on site all day, every day. So I think that's just one of the other ripple effects of this pandemic that we're going to see cities having to deal with and reimagine themselves.

Yeah, yeah, you're absolutely right. Thanks for plugging my sponsor once again. I appreciate that. We actually do. We have a live stream with Wendy Springberg on a previous episode.

She was one of my first podcast guests. So if you are interested, please search yes dash spaces that kind. She's certainly a resource for for flex work. She's been in the space for over 20 years. Let me tell you, she has a wealth of information on how this how the changes it relates to office spaces is has been happening and how it will continue to happen.

So 20 years, I mean, way ahead of the curb. Yeah, yeah, she knows the whole history. I shouldn't say the whole, but she knows quite a bit. But yeah, you know, Michael, with that, we don't have any questions coming in, but I am just so grateful to you once again. Thank you so much for joining us and joining the constructed community and having this conversation today.

Oh, it's been my pleasure. It's an honor and it's so good to see you again. Yes, yes. Well, with that, I just want to share, guys, if you want any more information, you can find this live stream on the website, Constructor.com. Just click live streams and it's right there.

But you can also follow us on YouTube, on Periscope, on LinkedIn. There's so many resources. You know, you can follow us on Facebook, Twitch. We just we just appreciate your support and we hope that you're getting value. So thank you, everyone who's listening out there.

All right. Bye. Enjoy the rest of your Friday. Bye, everybody. Bye, Brittany.

Thank you.